After some feedback and my initial thoughts after a playtest with my Blood Angels Blitzkrieg list, I decided to make a few tweaks. Ordinarily I'd like to get in a few games before making changes to a list, but there were some things that I felt needed to be addressed sooner than later. It seems I forgot that 5th ed. 40k still uses infantry models...oops.
For starters, I needed to fix a points issue. It seems I under-costed my Razorbacks by 5 points somehow. So that is fixed. Secondarily, I wanted to increase my killing power- specifically against infantry. I don't think it was a huge problem in the list, as tank shocking the shit out of infantry goes a long way when you start the game with ten vehicles, but we'll see what you guys think. Attempts to remove Sanguinary Priests from the list have proved pretty much fruitless, so I'll comment on that after the list. One Librarian was removed and I switched a Las/Plas back to a flamerback. This netted enough points for me to throw another minimum assault squad with infernus and melta into the list riding in another flamerback. I also switched the turrets on the Baals to assault cannons. I think I may try my hand at magnetizing a lot of this stuff when I make the jump to buy this. I think it'll pay off in the long run and let me flex my hobby muscles.
The above changes still keep most of the ranged power of the old list. I only lost 1 las/plas, but gained another Hunter-Killer Missile on the additional tank. The first shooting phase should still be pretty brutal if all goes as planned.
For your review, here is my new version of the Blood Angels 2,000 point Blitzkrieg list:
HQ
Librarian Shields of Sanguinis; Blood Lance 100
Elite
2x Sanguinary Priest combiflamer 120
Troops
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback TL Heavy Flamer; HK Missile 30
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback TL Heavy Flamer; HK Missile 30
Fast Attack
Baal Predator Assault cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Baal Predator Assault Cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Baal Predator Assault Cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Heavy Support
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Total 2,000 on the dot, unless I fucked up my maths again :(
Now, back to the sanguinary priests. They sort of feel like wasted points, but they are also a nice insurance policy. Plus they are toting combi-flamers for maximum burnination.
Here are two distinct alternatives for what could be had with the leftover points from dropping the priests:
For starters, I needed to fix a points issue. It seems I under-costed my Razorbacks by 5 points somehow. So that is fixed. Secondarily, I wanted to increase my killing power- specifically against infantry. I don't think it was a huge problem in the list, as tank shocking the shit out of infantry goes a long way when you start the game with ten vehicles, but we'll see what you guys think. Attempts to remove Sanguinary Priests from the list have proved pretty much fruitless, so I'll comment on that after the list. One Librarian was removed and I switched a Las/Plas back to a flamerback. This netted enough points for me to throw another minimum assault squad with infernus and melta into the list riding in another flamerback. I also switched the turrets on the Baals to assault cannons. I think I may try my hand at magnetizing a lot of this stuff when I make the jump to buy this. I think it'll pay off in the long run and let me flex my hobby muscles.
The above changes still keep most of the ranged power of the old list. I only lost 1 las/plas, but gained another Hunter-Killer Missile on the additional tank. The first shooting phase should still be pretty brutal if all goes as planned.
For your review, here is my new version of the Blood Angels 2,000 point Blitzkrieg list:
HQ
Librarian Shields of Sanguinis; Blood Lance 100
Elite
2x Sanguinary Priest combiflamer 120
Troops
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback Lascannon; TL Plasma gun; HK Missile 65
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback TL Heavy Flamer; HK Missile 30
Assault Squad Infernus Pistol, Melta 125
~Razorback TL Heavy Flamer; HK Missile 30
Fast Attack
Baal Predator Assault cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Baal Predator Assault Cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Baal Predator Assault Cannon, HB Sponsons; HK missile 155
Heavy Support
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Predator Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons; HK missile 145
Total 2,000 on the dot, unless I fucked up my maths again :(
Now, back to the sanguinary priests. They sort of feel like wasted points, but they are also a nice insurance policy. Plus they are toting combi-flamers for maximum burnination.
Here are two distinct alternatives for what could be had with the leftover points from dropping the priests:
- 3 man Death Company in Flamerback with no Hunter-Killer Missile. 5 points left over. It adds another TL heavy flamer, but seems like a pretty good way to give away 2 kill points. Not to mention that yet another vehicle on my side is going to continue cluttering up my deployment zone like a bastard.
- Also drop ALL infernus pistols to purchase a 5 man assault squad in a flamerback with a hunter-killer. This is looking like a decent idea, but would I miss the extra "oh-shit" melta shots?
9 comments:
Weight in? That's a bit personal, don't you think?
I don't like BA Razorspam. At all. There, I said it. I've had enough looks at people's attempts to say that with confidence. Whatever the list does, it doesn't win my heart.
So why did the Flamestorm cannons not work out for you?
Also, haven't received my Baal Preds in the mail yet - are the Flamestorm/Assault Cannons easily swapped on the model?
CPT: I don't have the Baal models yet either, but if they're like the regular Predators, then the turret weapon should be pretty easy to swap out...fingers crossed.
As far as the flamestorm cannon goes there are a couple of reasons to get rid of it.
1. decided on playing a more static game early on with the list, taking advantage of the "fast" vehicles to move a little and still unload fire. Then use the fast vehicles to rush to objectives closer to the end. AssCan, with some range, is better than a template weapon for this. it gets to shoot in the first few turns rather than sitting around with its dick in its hand. Rushing the baals forward ahead of the rest of the force to use a flamer doesn't seem like a good idea, as they will block los and fuck up my firelaes. Rushing the rest of my vehicles up with them seems pretty awful too, since I don't want my laser dakka preds or limited number of troops too close to enemy lines.
2. Duality- or at least slightly more of it. the asscan is more useful in the early turns at threatening transports than the flamestorm. it's not great, but fits into my general philosophy that if you shoot something a lot of times, it will eventually blow up.
3. Range- not great on the asscan, but still better than a template. this helps keep you out of melta range, which is where you want to be.'
I think the flamestorm would be more useful in a list that already has lots of anti-tank in it, but will feature a more in your face style. Something like Flying dreads and JPs that get in your face early on maybe.
I actually have nothing more to offer than this:
I greatly appreciate and find awesome the fact that you use the Irish Vampire from "The Preacher" graphic novel series as the icon. Kudos to you good sir.
Howdy
Have you thought about trying out land speeder squadrons armed with multi-meltas and heavy flamers. They are not as tough as the Baals, but they are cheaper and are a danger to tanks and footsloggers.
- Kris
Too funny. Already planned on naming my HF Raz Trogdor... Nic3e list, almost identical to mine but I went with melta/Power wpn..
Just finished my Storm Raven conversion.. need to figure out where to fit it in.. Im thinking putting it in reserve.. and hope for a round 3 drop or round two after some good anti ranged las-shooting. Also going to have librarian in the storm raven for the shield of sanguinius.
Psycho: glad you like the list. Don't know if I have any advice for fitting in a raven for you. Don't know if it really fits with no dreads to carry around, all your FA taken up by baals, and all your troops already meched up.
I'd also advise you to think about dropping those power weapons. From my limited play testing so far I think it's a good idea to squeeze in an infernus pistol. Only 1 melta shot per unit opens you up to lots of missing with your meltas.
Are you running priests in your list? If not I'd be curious to know what you've got instead, as I'm looking to drop them from my list, but can't seem to find a good way to do it.
Dethtron: I still run Priests and they have done phenomenally well for foot slogging after a rhino gets popped. I just shield them as much as possible with a baal, and try and keep them subjected to only small arms fire and the occassional hidden melta. Yeah, I figure I am going to have to revamp the entire list and build it around the delivery of the StormRaven with a Dread and a nasty assault squad. Most likely a fluff list jus to use my conversion :P I can't imagine anything as useful for the 100 pts as the two priests.
mkay, so some changes i made to my razor spam list..
I totally got rid of the sponsons on the baal's. I am always running them 12 to keep them fast and at 6 to hit.. so the sponsons never see any action.
My HF raz have become t.l. ass cannons because the ass cannon is good vs transports and walkers AND can hose a good deal of infantry, especially being fast.
My sgts pack either the infernus or a hand flamer. And my squads pack either meltas or flamers.. still working on a ratio I like.
And I always go power weapon as opposed to fistol. The extra armor denying save is nice, and when combined with a priest with power weapon makes a 5 man squad perform like 10 men.
With the spare points from sponsons i'd also pack every priest with a combi melta for that just in case, scenario where you run into armor heavy armies and miss with a melta shot.
Also look into one vindicator and two predators with twin link las on turret with no sponsons... again the fast argument.
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