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Wednesday, July 21, 2010

Prepare to be Vanquished

We've all seen this thread.  Somebody asks for help picking the best load out for a Leman Russ.  Before you even read any further into the thread, you already know it's going to be packed to the gills with incredibly bad advice: the main battle tank is awesome, put sponsons on just about anything, lascannons are a great value, and my personal favorite- The Vanquisher is the best tank around.  When I was cruising DakkaDakka earlier today I stumbled across just such a thread.  Russ Variant Load Outs asks Leman Russ armament question and is met immediately with some of the worst (and subsequently most staunchly defended) advice I have seen in quite some time.

Here's what Lord Command Phyrus had to say about this:
my favourite, the Vanquisher, very good for taking out enemt Landraiders etc, usualy no sponsons for me since none of them realy commpliment the main gun. again hull lascannon and usualy Pask, makes it 220 pnts but it generaly manages to kill a Landraider or some such every game

At least he got the no sponsons right.  He didn't get it right in talking about some other tanks, but that's another rant for another day.  Let's vivisect that little turd-nugget of advice. 
  • Cost- at 220 points this tank barely earns its points back if you manage to peel caps in a Landraider, which presupposes that your opponent has a LR equivalent target to shoot at.  I hope he isn't bringing jump-packing Blood Angels or anything Tau or Nids or you get the idea.  If I were playing nids I would laugh as you put a wound on one of my monstrous creatures and then proceed to mount your tank from behind and violate all 220 points worth of its tailpipe.  Q: does Pask look like a bitch.  A: Yes, and that is precisely why I am trying to fuck him like one.  What are some other things that are good at taking out AV14 and have a reasonable threat range that could be taken in lieu of the Paskmobile?  You could almost get 2 Devil Dogs, about 1.5 3x Melta Vets in a Chimera, A demolisher with some points left over, nearly 2 Vendettas (not the best at AV14, but TL and multiple shots help them out), close to 2 Medusas, or even a Manticore with points to spare.  Short answer, you can get things that are just about as good at taking out armor at range that will allow you to buy more units and provide greater duality, which brings me to my next point
  • Duality- the Paskmobile lacks this.  As mentioned above, if you don't have an armored target, Pask will be sitting around with his dick in his hand the whole game.  Add in that expensive lascannon (that is quite prone to missing and quite prone to bouncing off of thick armor) and you have one hell of a fireworks show that could possibly result in 2 dead infantry or a couple wounds on an MC.  Not having a blast template on the main gun kills this.  Other cheaper options can still wail on tanks from afar, but offer superior infantry and MC killing power.  Increase my killing power, eh?
  • One off- Hey fluff bunnies, guess what...there's only one Pask.  That means you have to put all your egg in one basket to pull this off.  Better hope you're going first or have some ninja deployment skills to prevent people from shooting at your expensive ass tank with a fucking target painted on it.  All it will take to shut your points sink-hole of a tank down is a shaken/stunned result.  Then poof, 10%+ of your army isn't in the fight anymore.  Now the (possibly extant) Land Raider is free to move up into the midfield and start raping face.  OR if there is no LR and I don't gie a shit about your Paskmobile and I move on to targets that might be able to contribute to the game.
That's it for today.  Anybody have a real favorite Russ load out besides the obviously fantastic Demolisher with heavy flamer and no sponsons?  And I swear if anybody says that the LRMBT with a lascannon is awesome I will destroy you.  It's not that it's awful, but it's really not particularly good against vehicles, thus failing the duality test.  Not good enough to qualify as the best variant at all.


Chumbalaya said...

Demolisher, Eradicator and plasma sponson Executioner for me. S10 AP2 kicks ass, full stop. S6 AP4 cover-ignoring isn't as flexible, but rocks face since everybody has infantry hiding in cover. 5 plasma cannons is loltastic, but it's pricey and needs bubblewrap.

Honorable mention goes to the LRBT (jack of all trades, master of none) and Exterminator (AV14 Hydra)

DFM said...

punisher w/hull lcannon, plasma sponsons, extra armor, Pask, HK and camo netting!! Gotta have the camo netting or it doesn't work...

Now seriously, I don't use my tanks to crack AV 14, thats what melta's are for in my lists.

Stripped down lrbt's and demo's are what frequents my lists for the most part(altho I do have a hard-on for the punisher, I'm under no illusions that it's a good tank) because thats what I have, but they also bring some of that vaunted duality.

I can crack light/medium armor, and the squishy man-pig-babies that fall out of the cans afterwords.

I never take the lascannon on the hull. It's heavy bolter or heavy bolter on them(again, what I have)

The_King_Elessar said...

If I could pay 20 points less not to have a Hull weapon, I may well have already bought my IG army.

SandWyrm said...

"If I were playing nids I would laugh as you put a wound on one of my monstrous creatures and then proceed to mount your tank from behind and violate all 220 points worth of its tailpipe."

Good thing I wasn't drinking anything when I read that.

You forgot to mention that Pask loses half his abilities if you actually, um, move the tank.

I actually like LRBTs with hull lascannons. No, they're not awesome at anti-armor, but they're not that bad either.

Mercer said...

Punisher with Paask and heavy bolter sponsons for the win!!! lol.

Seriously, standard Russ with hull flamer is decent. Demolisher with hull flamer or multi melta is ok. Executioner is costly and is ok with sponsons. That's about it.

Thread hijack, you should check imperiusdominatus.com for the goons I've had to put up on Heresy!

Tinkling Koala said...

Bare bones Demolisher, maybe with Heavy Flamer sponsons. The Eraditcator is also fun times with the same loadout.

Magnets are your friend, I can swap out all the guns on my Russes. If you're willing to work with putty even the sponson casings can be made detachable.

Momba said...

the LRMBT with a lascannon is awesome